Next Gen: What next generation cloud infrastructure means for the industries of tomorrow

Hello everybody and welcome. My name is Sue Daly. I’m director of technology and innovation at Tech UK and it’s my pleasure to be the chair for this conversation today about cloud future and what next generation cloud infrastructure is going to mean for industries of tomorrow and industry 4.0. We’ve got two amazing speakers here today to talk about this really broad but fascinating topic. I’m going to ask them both to introduce themselves and then we’ll kick off the discussion without further ado. Kate, great to have you with us. Can you just introduce yourself and your role perhaps and tell us a little bit about yourself? Yeah absolutely. So Kate’s mage, I’m a senior partner from McKinsey based other UK and I lead McKinsey Digital Forest Globally which includes all of our capabilities around things like cloud as and board of technology in AI. Oh really great to have you here. Thank you. In person as well. Sorry it’s like to dom great to see you again. Thank you for having me. Yeah my name is Dom Polaniki and I’m the general manager for Nutanix in Western Europe, Sub-Saharan Africa. So we’re a cloud software company and we help clients deal with exactly the issues we’re talking about today. What does the cloud of the future look like? How do we deal with hybrid, multi-cloud, digital transformation and all the associated issues and benefits and everything else that comes with that? Brilliant. Two amazing speakers I’m sure you agree but also we were all slightly overexcited because this is the first time we’ve done a physical event, isn’t it? So it’s brilliant. They have you here at Coggins so thank you so much for being here. So we’re talking about the future of cloud and what it means for industry 4.0, what the future may hold. But perhaps before we think to the future perhaps let’s just take a moment to reflect on where we’ve come from in the last 16, 18 months. And be interesting to see what you both have seen in terms of changes and business approaches and adoption and use is particularly of course of cloud adoption over the pandemic and what we’ve seen. Dom do you want to kick us off what you’ve been seeing? Sure. Well obviously it’s been extraordinary whatever it is 16 months for everybody. And the first thing I’ve been asked this question a lot as you can imagine the first thing I say is you know to everybody watching and and there today particularly those IT leaders and the suppliers and partners have been helping customers through this is you know to commend everybody for getting through this you know and you know that is to ensure you know their their own companies remain operational, continuity of service for their for their customers and frankly keeping the global economy alive in the last 18 months. And actually yesterday I was looking through the honors list, the Queen’s honors list because loads of people honored for you know vaccination programs and the Anexia and rightly so of course now just looking you know who in technology has been honored for you know keeping the economy alive. So that that may be my first observation and maybe maybe I’ll come back to what I’m seeing going forward as well. Yeah great. Okay really it has been in my mind cloud has helped keep us all digitally connected while we’ve been physically part. I mean is that would you agree or what have you been seeing? Yeah hugely so I think we’ve shown new heat and light on you know what it means to be in the cloud in the last in the last sort of 16 18 months and it takes different forms for different companies right so for some it’s been about having greater flexibility in this period of time and you know as business leaders have had to ask new and different questions of their businesses and look at data in different ways and so on and do that at speed. It’s allowed them to do that and we’ve seen a big divide almost between those that were let’s call it cloud proficient even if it’s not sort of fully there yet cloud proficient you know before and during the pandemic and those that that weren’t and I think it’s increased that golf and for others it’s been about resilience you know have I been able to you know overnight switch everybody to remote working how’s that actually you know panned out as you know as technology has sort of a subsumed our lives shall we say over the last yeah 16 18 months so I think I think people now talk about it in a way that is more connected with how the business works. Yeah and that kind of takes us seamlessly on to thinking about perhaps where we’re heading and I suppose take UK we’ve kind of seen that a lot of there were a lot of organizations who are still thinking about cloud or doing more with cloud who kind of when right we just have to do it right so they’ve kind of moved forward which makes me think what’s the strategy what’s the approach the organizations are going to take for the next step you know and what happens next and I’m interested in perhaps take it would just kick on with you in terms of the strategy that businesses are taking are you seeing it and do you think it will be kind of perhaps where we were before around lifting and shifting or more data more applications to the cloud or is it about how cloud can drive real business transformation digital transformation going forward what what do you see yeah and and there’s a there’s a disconnect here between what what what do I see and what would I like to see and I think the unfortunate reality is there’s actually not that much strategy at the moment around how to think about cloud we did a survey not long ago about 40 different just over 40 different boards and asked some of the question about how they’re you know what is their strategy for cloud what level of discussion that they have in the boardroom about you know about these topics and actually found that a third wouldn’t even have the conversation right just doesn’t even bubble up to board level around this of course management is doing a ton of stuff but it’s not bubbling up to board so my my first point I think would be I guess a bit of concern that it’s not more strategic today now where do I see that going from here then I guess my optimistic sort of center comes comes to bear and I think what we’ll see is much more attention on you know how is this really linked with business strategy so not cloud for cloud sake not the next IT you know iteration and someone saying who why have you not modernized more but much more intrinsically linked to how the business value will be created so you know if I’m a retailer and I know that personalisation is going to be you know core and front and centre to what I need to do over the next few years well how does cloud help me to do that yeah right if I’m an oil and gas company and I’ve got to put AI at the heart of how I you know decide to increase mind throughput well how does cloud help me to do that so I think we’ll see that and then I think we’ll have to see more attention on the economics and there’s a lot of push towards just sort of saying well go to cloud I’ve got to do it I wasn’t there I’m going to do it now and I think we’re going to see an already seeing a lot of companies pause and say hang on a minute did I go too far too fast have I really thought about the economics of this look like from what this is costing the business on a day-to-day basis exactly exactly on a day-to-day basis and you know as it projects forward yeah I can completely agree on on the cost piece which I’ll come on to but I think you know we’re going to still see like in a lot whether there’s a strategy or not more rapid adoption and fossil growth in cloud it’s massive as a as a market it’s $330 billion market and it’s still growing 21 22 23 percent year of years so it’s huge to your point Kate you know I see I see the economics question coming up a lot different survey not yours that I read from Flexera about 2021 states of the cloud found that of the 750 cloud global leaders they spoke to 31 percent of them are spending now over a million dollars a month on cloud and that’s up from 20 percent the year before so it’s got to be a big focus on you know is that a good use of money and the same survey found that they thought 30 percent of that spend was was waste to spend so there’s more to do around optimizing etc I think the other piece on top of strategy is data and I guess you touched on it about AI and specific use cases is that you know there’s going to be so much more data generated but now in different places so on premise in the cloud and much more at the edge terms of IoT and I think forecasts is you know we’ll see in the next few years 50 percent or more of the data being produced at the edge so it’s about you know with all that complexity of the data and front of unify all that data so you can get the insights that you describe Kate is how do I bring all that together and that’s going to bring some more challenges as we go forward but opportunities as well. Absolutely and in fact I think our next session which is coming up at one is around edge computing and I think that’s going to talk a little bit about the relationship between edge and cloud we’re seeing that as a conversation that take you came more than we’ve ever ever seen before so that seems to be where the thinking is going particularly when you put the kind of autonomous vehicles driver’s cars smart city of gender and you put all this together and what does that mean but thinking about the kind of business point of view and perhaps from a technical point of view because Donald would love to know we hear a lot about businesses talking about cloud first right and are you still hearing that is that the approached organizations are taking and is that the right approach? Well I guess in part Kate’s talked to that about the board level so perhaps yes but without a strategy behind it but I think my perspective of our perspective at Nutanix is depends what you mean by cloud if by cloud first you know that’s synonymous with public cloud I would say the answer is no in part because the economics if by cloud first you mean by cloud as an operating model then I think the answer is yes and I think that you know the hyperscalers have done an amazing job in only 15 years old basically is the first inception of AWS and now a 330 billion market of actually driving the other vendors in the data center space to actually up their game and bring that cloud experience to some of those cloud services everywhere not just in the public cloud not just on prem but also at the edge so seeing loads of innovation there and I think there are some really recent examples of where public cloud if you could describe that as cloud first is not necessarily the strategy a good recent example is Dropbox who famously or informously drove a repatriation strategy bringing stuff back on prem and optimizing at the same time and driving you know significant saving double a doubling their gross margin as a consequence so other other examples and I think we might come onto security where there are security reasons where public cloud might not be you know the right thing DWP is a good example where they have recently extended their contract with Crown Commercial hosting for certain data certain applications that just can’t go to public cloud so I think long answer your question but if cloud first means cloud as an operating model yes if it’s still on us with public then no for a number of reasons I wonder as I think because I’m totally in your camp on this too I think then just the term cloud first as it’s sort of bandied around like buzzword bingo is actually dangerous right it’s not even whether good right or wrong it’s I think it’s quite dangerous because there’s not enough understanding yet exactly to your point about what that means and you know as we see companies make some of these decisions you know you have to be really really clear about or which workloads you know first and foremost so exactly to your drop box example heavily storage intensive workloads it’s not clear that that is entirely right to be 100% on cloud you know equally what does the architecture of the you know the applications the platforms and so on that you’re making the the move across because unless you’ve really thought about the changes to that architecture you could spend inordinates amounts of of money without really consciously thinking through it so the re-architecting is the second sort of determinant and then the third is actually say operating model unless you know unless you change the way you do your testing environments and so on as you make those moves it’s not entirely clear and so the the companies that we see sort of go out and say oh we’re cloud first the nuance that sits underneath that is really really important to get right both technically and strategically in that context and Don’s right I mean I would add I think you had four fifth one would be security as well in terms of them we’ll come on to that in a minute but just before we move away from that kind of approach because for organizations that are born in the cloud whatever you want to call it that’s easy for for those that have a not then legacy infrastructure and legacy issues still come up time and time again I know they do in our conversations as well but Dom that’s how businesses struggling with that how are they how do you get that yeah I think you know there will always be some legacy customers coexist between you know we’re modernising what they have moving into the cloud and into multiple clouds and I’m just saying that you can do that right it’s not one slice of it so all it’s not black away it can do that right yeah and I think a lot of that comes back to some of the cost models we’ve talked about and that’s you know the the benefit of the growth we’ve seen is that you know customers have been able to see what that flexibility and agility can give particularly bringing new services to markets since some amazing examples since financial services but you know as we’ve discussed you know actually in some cases that that’s cost cost prohibitive prohibitive so we’re seeing in the technology lines and companies is much more focused on how do I make sure that my applications my data my VM is my containers whatever it is are portable so that you know through the life cycle of an application we can make the right economic choice about whether that application says so being agile and be flexible and being able to adapt webstratio that seems to be a key thing is that Kate what you’re hearing or what you’re seeing for your own actually look it’s a very dynamic space I don’t think cloud market itself is changing tremendously isn’t that exactly it is and I think the the folks that will win out of this are the ones that actually do have the visibility to understand how they’re spending what choices that they’ve made how they’re incentivizing you know developers and so on to actually develop in the right way on you know in the cloud and you know so I don’t think it is a one size fits all way any stretch of the imagination I think those that understand the nuance and then can track and pivot where that nuance changes other ones that win and we’ve got a question actually coming in which I want to kind of bring in to this because if we think about how organizations get this right we have to question around panels perspective on cost when we’ve been talking about those but also in the environmental aspects and it’s such as green AI but of course the there is a conversation around the mood to cloud computing and perhaps the sustainability of the climate change impact this is something we’re doing quite a bit of thinking and work on at Tech UK because there’s a lot of arguments there of how a mood to cloud can help organizations reduce their carbon footprint reduce their energy across the I’m wondering hey is that really becoming part of the conversation you’re seeing either from a green AI point of view or from a from a cloud point of view yeah absolutely and at not least because I think it gives you it gives you the impetus to challenge you know historic ways of doing this and so on so no we definitely see that front and center in the in the debates and in some ways it’s one of the things that I think is pulling the cloud debate into the boardroom because the boardroom is absolutely discussing sustainability right now and therefore if this is one of the levers one of the means to really make a step change around that the two per me go hand in hand right that’s interesting and it’s it’s going to be something we’re going to have to talk more and more about as an industry right on yeah and I think again I see it as an enabler for that for that change and improvement you know just I guess at a technical level you know just by virtue of moving to more shared infrastructure you’re generally going to get better utilization some of the storage technologies associated with public cloud or private clouds means you’re getting a lot more compression at storage level which basically means that you can put you know more into fewer servers and into fewer storage arrays and therefore collapse amount of racks you’ve got for running the same work like so definitely you know you’re driving the green agenda you know and again a lot of that comes back to how you’re architecting applications in the first place to benefit from some of those native services it’s really extremely interesting that that’s no driving that conversation as well because that helps bring it up to board level and I wonder if actually before we maybe talk about security Kate just touch on the AI is there an is there a link between kind of the AI conversation the cloud conversation is that’s something you’re seeing more of yeah very much because so many of the use cases the AI being you know is being used for requires the the level of particularly on public cloud but both requires the level of shift across to there to actually get you know full value out of it but it’s also because a lot of the practitioners who are really really good in that space are the ones who are challenging you know how to think about MLOPS and so on around you know around this which again you know all of these pieces and your point on data earlier right all of these pieces are coming together so part of this I think is about you know the tech community if you like really using these different routes in let’s call it to challenge and to say hang on a minute I think there’s a better way of there’s a better way of doing this and there’s a lot of owners on I think you know all of us as a tech community making sure that we do voice that yeah and I mean my I mean my world and I go out and talk to I’ll go out virtually all go out talk to a lot of people it’s about telling that story of convergence as well right it’s not just cloud it’s not to say I it’s not just edge right bomb it’s how all these we talk about industry 4.0 and the industries of tomorrow they’re going to need a little bit of everything right but then it’s how you bring that all seamlessly together but the cloud or cloud is at the heart of that in my mind but you agree yeah and it’s it’s it’s easy to say and really hard to do and and you know every business now whether you know whatever department you’re in whether it’s sales marketing as you talk to finance HR everybody needs more data to drive more insights to deliver better service to their internal external customers so and there’s more data than ever and you know we all know the stats around that so the challenge is how do you unify that data so that you can actually you know and a lot of that data you know at the edge which I know you’re coming onto another session is unstructured and that makes it more complex so from a cloud perspective is how can you create a we describe as a unified data plan so that you can ensure that the data is in the right place at the right time and then therefore be able to apply data analytics tool sets to to derive that insight for for our companies so definitely it’s helping but it’s it’s also complex exactly what you need for AI right you need data I mean it’s the I don’t like so it’s all data is the oil or the fuel but it’s electricity right it’s what makes it helps it run exactly right so fascinating area it’s you know you start with cloud but suddenly it takes you into so many different different fields but um one thing that is uh is across everything is security right we you mentioned this one we kicked off and but I think it’s important to think about as well talking about cloud in the future and what it means for industries of tomorrow and we want to encourage more people to use more cloud services right but got to do it in a safer secure way and we saw last year of course a lot of people moving to cloud which is great a lot of people using cloud more and more but we also saw the online threat environment and the online threats continue to evolve and continue to move at pace um and we’re doing quite a bit of work at tech decay about how do we help then guide organizations how do we help business leaders who may have done more on cloud or maybe looking to do more on cloud to i suppose um not just adopt and use it but scale up and increase their usage but in a safe and secure way so um how do we get the balance right between doing more with cloud or scaling up the use of cloud perhaps let’s say an organization dom has moved to cloud or has started using more cloud services last year they want to do more now going forward perhaps they see and we can perhaps touch on this and i see cloud as key to the recovery and the rebuilding and maybe even reinvention of lots of organizations as they look to you know what the future may hold so what advice how do we get that right how do you get the message and how do we get the narrative right of you can do more with cloud but you can also do in a safe and secure way i mean that’s a panel and itself right i mean uh if there’s one topic that gets straight to the boardroom it’s security yeah probably even out of environmental’s particularly when things go wrong um you know and clearly it’s been some pretty high profile issues uh recently so to name a couple the colonial pipeline at ransomware attack in uh western us uh which you know in that particular case ended up uh with the ransom payment of eleven million dollars to actually relinquish that data uh and you know right you’re wrongly that payment you know was made against the FBI’s recommendation but you know when you’re running a pipeline that is servicing hospitals and and other critical services that and you can’t operate then you know you need to take some of the drastic decisions um and i guess locally we’ve had our own NHS one a few years ago and uh and all of these are are expensive either from you know uh lack of operation you know you know non-operation ransom payments or indeed you know regulatory fines when you’re not compliant with some of the regulatory framework so it’s an expensive business you know and depending on when you talk to this is costing the economy anyway we’re between 30 and 120 billion dollars a year so it’s big it’s a big problem now what can you do about it i guess the question is um probably a few things vis-a-vis clouds so the first perspective i have is that you know by virtue of moving to cloud your perimeter is broadening right so you know the old way of you know intrusion detection and prevention tool sets you know just keep in mind that your your perimeter if you like that your protecting is broader by virtue of the complexity that that uh that brings um uh secondly that you’re not outsourcing the responsibility of security to the public cloud provider you know many cases you’re just consuming their infrastructure as a service but you’re still responsible for you know compliance and and you know for data goes missing it’s your problem um and and the third um you know the third thing is around um ensuring that you got a wave of recovering right so um on the second piece around you know kind of compliance is there a number of tool sets that can help you assess you know a particular environments actually compliant with my regulatory framework and with my you know security policies yeah that can then look at remedial ways of addressing that on the piece about recovering back you know from a strategic point of view you’ve got to assume you’re gonna have an attack or you’re gonna have some data loss not not if but when and therefore how can i find a way to recover back to a place that was previously unaffected and there are some great technologies uh like object storage for instance that give you effectively a musical storage that you you know you write once to you read many times it can’t be over it and it can’t be accessed and so you’ve got that wine back ability to to get back to a better place and you know that helps you not fool i guess pray to ransomware attackers because you know you’ve got a way back to to a place that was once unaffected so that would be you know general recommendations wow i think as well it’s just it’s a it’s an unfair misnomer of saying that public cloud equals insecure just it’s where a long way a long way on from from that place but i think it also puts a bit of the onus you know again back into the the boardroom maybe around you know how you’re actually thinking about this as a as a whole integrated topic so you know one of the questions i hate most is are we safe yet in terms of in terms of cybersecurity in terms of you know migration to cloud and and the answer will always be no yeah um because you’ll never be safe but you can be safer today than you were yesterday and you’ll be safer tomorrow because the notice is freeing as a hundred percent security right correct correct and so for me this is much more of a risk problem of do we really are we actually asking the right questions on how we are managing risk i mean don’t you mention legacy environments earlier you know a lot of the risk is coming through the fact that you do still have some stuff in legacy environments and some stuff in you know in other places and how you’re managing it you know disproportionately the risk between the two as well as the human right still when you look at all of the examples that that you mentioned it is even more a human problem than it is a technology problem and so you know boards can’t sort of relinquish the responsibility for really making sure that their people know the risks understand the choices that they’re making and understand their role to help keep the technology doing as good a job as it can and i mean to your point Kate so it’s it’s board level discussion that’s great but that’s then got to trickle down not trickle but it’s got a it’s a responsibility yes what’s all about the whole organization because it can be that you know somebody in another department is you know um lifting and shifting something to the cloud because that that is the right thing to do and it makes sense but then if that leaves and i’m going to be really untanical now sorry Dom a port open or some a doorway open that allows someone to get into your infrastructure then suddenly you have a problem right so it that is that training or an awareness or is that just getting people more to think about how they’re using cloud services yeah and some of the and some of the choices they’ve made you know some of the more recent you know supply chain sort of attacks that we’ve we’ve seen you know required perhaps the finance department to ask what’s that third party vendor how does that integrate with my current systems and so on and traditionally that hasn’t been their purview it hasn’t had to be everybody in management or even further down the management’s view to ask those questions and now it is yeah right but it’s supposed in one way um if the last what year and a half has shown us even in our everyday life how important cloud services whether it’s you know a video call with friends whether it’s being able to work from home or being able to take you know um call center calls for in your kitchen I love bringing utility companies and then you hear like family in the background you realize they’re in their kitchen all of this has been enabled by cloud release so we have a greater understanding do you think now of how important cloud is to all of our lives and we’ll be going for yeah I think so and I’ve seen that in some of the budgets that have been authorized for IT going forward you know um sometimes the unsung heroes are now you know right at the forefront of of organizations whether it’s be to keep the lives on we’ve we’ve described or you know help deliver some amazing you know new kind of born in the cloud web-based services you know uh that you know ordinarily in the big let’s say financial services organization might have been a three-year program actually within months you know they’re spinning up new services like uh you know and and and making those available and it’s actually you know that’s been enabled by cloud and and also you know not necessarily pushing for perfection that may have been kind of the strategy of the past because that we’ve been able to do because it’s been necessary right yes so uh yes it’s been an amazing amazing time do you think that speed and that pace that we’ve seen and questions here about the donpas do you think that pace and that um speed that we’ve seen over the last year and a half will continue do you think that’s gonna you know set the pace now for what happens next i certainly hope so because you know because we’re in that business only but um yeah i suspect so i think there’s there’s gonna be some you know some shifts of whether priorities are but you know as i said from from what i’m seeing from a budgeting perspective it’s certainly going to see you know continued investment um and acceleration um all the forecasts have saved you know that you know at minimum 20% year-over-year growth in that cloud spend i think the question is going to be kind of where we started is you know are we getting your return on that investment and how do we optimize you know that spend and is it deriving real business benefit you know for the for the organisation that’s that’s the key that’s going to be driving it right okay yeah very much so i mean i think uh yeah i think companies are gonna have to ask some of the tougher questions around um okay we we did this to move fast you know we now sure that it’s it’s all the right set of decisions yeah so we’re we’re obviously having a fascinating conversation please do if you’ve got questions so do um bring them through i’m sure i was supposed to have mentioned that before apologies um i’ve got one last question for the panel but so please do if you’ve got any questions please please do um keep them coming in we’ve had it if you’re ready i’m trying to kind of keep an eye on that and keep an eye on you guys at the same time it’s all the the new world of hybrid right um um so i suppose just just thinking about the future of cloud right that’s what we talk about and what we think the future of the cloud market might look like i’m really intrigued given your views of uk or even globally what you might see happen next with the cloud market in the cloud industry i’ve been from an industry point of view or from an adoption deployment and i’m going to be really horrible and say any predictions i hate it when people ask me that like don’t hold me to anything and let’s see what happens but any predictions for what the future might hold Kate do you want to kick a film well i don’t know if this is a prediction i’m not fan of predictions either but that maybe a a view of the potential of this market you know we did some work um last year looking at the sort of the ebit dart impact that we expect to see um cloud provide for companies and we you know tore down all the different use cases that could possibly you know come through innovation and so on we’d look at 700 different use cases and what we found was effectively a one trillion dollar um uh opportunity at the ebit dial level around this and it takes different forms right it’s the rejuvenate side of things so you know just pure cost optimization make it make what you do today run better and so on as the innovation side of it of you know known proven technologies and how they innovate that’s by the way the biggest bucket and then there’s all the stuff that you were alluding to earlier soon as well around you know how you actually use newer technologies um you know what this is going to do when blockchain all the stuff at the edge right when blockchain you know is is more pervasive augmented reality virtual reality mixed reality whatever it may be all of those all of those use cases are an even higher amount than than what we can see so i don’t know i come at this from a sort of bullish perspective of there’s a lot of business value to be created here not all tackle it in the same way or should um but there is a lot of value that it can unlock if if companies can get it right yeah yeah i’ll probably give uh maybe shorter to medium term view you can see knows all the long term looks like but i agree i agree i agree with that yeah exactly to be get it right but certainly you know rapid growth expected um you know i mentioned that survey earlier that flex areas state of the cloud so of the 750 respondents there 90 percent said that they’re expecting as of consequence of covid 19 their clouds um spend to outstrip their expectations so it’s only going in one direction i think the things i’m seeing short term again we’ve labored it a little bit is is cost optimization so a couple of things there one is you know tool sets to enable companies to optimize their cloud spend you know some of those will be available from the hyperscalism cells or the third party tools to look at was that look like across your entire state but if you’re in a multi cloud environment for instance and there’s some native ones that uh you know spotifies a really good example where they built their ad to to to to do exactly that to cost optimize you mentioned incentives i’ve seen that as well where ctos are saying hey let’s incentivize the people that are probably closer to the problem the developers the engineers to say well actually what if you uh what if you actually switch off that workload or or optimize that workload i’ll give you i’ll give you a bonus i’ll give you a 10k bonus to say you know to to show me how you can reduce your utilization by this much and the reason why that pays off is because take that example let’s say you’re spending a thousand a month for that particular workload in in the public cloud it gets switched off because actually it should have been retired ages ago you get a 12k return or two k return and you’re 10k so and it’s and that’s recurring yeah yeah so seeing some some things like that and then i think the other piece slightly repeats myself but you know is is around the database and and just the amount of data whether it’s in you know for actual reality or you know autonomous cars whatever it is actually how do we harness that data and cloud will be a key part of that being able to have a unified data plane that can which is again really easy to say and very very difficult to do will be will be corner because that’s about you know actually really harnessing the benefit of what what cloud can bring you know in public cloud on-prem in private and at the edge well it’s a fascinating future to look forward to and cloud being at the heart of it it’s going to be something that we’re going to have to continue to talk about and and help organizations getting right right but brilliant insights and thank you both so so much thank you sir i don’t think we have any more questions so i’ve covered everything we’ve covered everything we’ve done the future cloud is secure in more ways than what i’ve done but Kate don’t thank you so much for being with us today and and and being at Coggex and talking through the future cloud was absolutely fascinating for them thank you so much and great to see you see right so i think it leaves me to kind of wrap up the next generation infrastructure and industry 4.0 stage for this morning on behalf of techie case this has been a brilliant uh uh load of sessions this morning i know um so if you’re coming back we will kick off again now it’s time for lunch so um it’s beautiful out there right so go and grab a sandwich go and go for a walk go and get some fresh air but be back here at one uh where we are talking about um the edge computing but we were just talking about edge with uh Colby Ranger from Atos Steven Passon from arm and Caroline Gorsky from Rolls Royce talking about their views on edge computing i will be back to talk exactly about AI in the data center industry coming together with Simms Witherspoon from Deep Mind and then later on i will be here talking to Paul Stein the CTO on Rolls Royce talking about how hard tech and high tech need to come together as that industry evolves so some fascinating discussions coming up but with that um on behalf of techie case it’s like to thank Dom and Kate again for a fascinating conversation and and we’ll look forward to seeing you all back here to talk about edge computing at 1pm and with that i’ll say thank you.

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